Mapping new experiences with Sanya Deshpande

After years of traditional strategy training at shops VMLY&R and PHD, Sanya Deshpande was inspried by the offering of Oura Ring. She talks about what elements of her experience have served her in this new world, and what she’s had to learn and help create.

You can find Sanya on LinkedIn:

Transcript of this conversation:

Adam Pierno 0:02
The Strategy Inside Everything is the podcast for people who think for a living. If this conversation gives you an idea leads to a question or makes you want to push back on something new here. Go to where you can leave a message or send me a voicemail. The best and most interesting will be added to in future episodes, and I can’t wait to hear from you.

All right, welcome back to another episode of the strategy inside everything. It is lovely to be back. We’re going to have a wonderful conversation. It took some time for us to schedule with the dynamics of today’s wild world. But today I have the senior brand manager for Oura ring. Sanya Deshpande has joined us. How are you?

Sanya Deshpande 0:56
Good. How are you? Good. I’m excited to be here. Thanks for the opportunity.

Adam Pierno 0:59
Yeah, of course. I’m glad we were finally able to make it work. Yeah, yeah. Thanks for Thanks for playing the rodeo with me as we calendar rodeo as we figured out timing. Totally, totally. Well, I’m really excited to talk to you because you’ve had a interesting career in the your perspective has shifted on the on the role of marketing and which side of the fence you’ve been on. And now you’re rolling in at Oura is a really interesting one as well. So before we dive into the conversation, would you give people a sense of who you are and where you’ve been before you got to where you are now?

Sanya Deshpande 1:37
Yeah, totally happy to share my background, it’s it’s certainly, you know, will be evident that I’ve a little bit of a global citizen have hopped around various different continents in different parts of the world through my experience, but I grew up in India to spend the greater part of my childhood in Mumbai and moved to Boston over a decade ago for college. And at the time, was quite convinced I wanted to pursue a career in international affairs and be a diplomat had a I had a completely different career trajectory in mind. You know, when I when I left for for Boston,

Adam Pierno 2:14
just a little different, you ended up just a little different, right, a smidge of a pivot there.

Sanya Deshpande 2:22
And it was great, because I think for me, travel was always a huge part of my identity of early on living in India, I wanted to see you know, as much of the world and experiences that I as I could. And it was able to do that through colleges spent three summers in three different countries was quite convinced I wanted this career in diplomacy, sort of the last one and at the UN in Geneva. And a very serendipitous entry into advertising happened when my father was actually in advertising in India, asked me to help him with some research. So sitting around in the summer of India, eating mangoes and all the Indian food of the world, he was like, make yourself useful. Who aren’t you do some research, you know, since you seem to do a lot of that at the UN. And I helped him with a research brief about retailing Cadbury chocolates to luxury Indian balls, and had to go talk to people about how they perceive luxury chocolates, what it means to them what buying, you know, a brand from the UK means like what what is like, it was very, very interesting.

Adam Pierno 3:28
How old were you?

Sanya Deshpande 3:30
I was like, I they think 19

Adam Pierno 3:34
Oh, okay, you were an adult.

Sanya Deshpande 3:40
Yeah, I was an adult. But, you know, people looked at me kind of weirdly, not a lot of ethnographic research happening on the streets of India. He was like, Who is this person? Why am I being asked a question? So it was, it was a great experience, because it you know, was able to really dig into that research and start to realize, like, advertising could be really interesting, because research was, you know, common thread for me in my studies and in the work I was doing. So, you know, very quickly this diplomatic career was was now behind me, after after a little research sprint, and I then moved to New York landed up planning to get RGA. And frankly, that was my first foray into advertising and incredible and changed my world because I was exposed to some of the sharpest minds in advertising, who really taking the strategy practice to the next level of innovation, experience, design, and so much more. I was very sort of convinced that there’s so much here that I can take to different aspects of my career. And that’s how I sort of landed in strategy. After this brief stint at RGA moved to NYU to get my Master’s in marketing because I felt like I didn’t really know what marketing was all about and where to learn more answers to took classes at stern and I’m the Marketing School at NYU. And after after, we just sort of landed at VML, which perhaps be began where my, you know, advertising career began, I guess so. And it was great, you know, worked on a ton of different brands, fast pace, creative agency environment. I was there for about four years, I moved to London with their team to worked on a couple of European accounts. During the time, we won the New Balance pitch. So that was a very exciting part of, of being there. So really, really great time, you know, VML, and, you know, just sort of first first experience in the creative agency world. And at the time, it was interesting because a friend and a mentor had started heading up comms planning a PhD, and I was always mesmerized by the world of media, I felt like I really speak that language very much. While I was at a creative agency, they were always there was always a media agency in the background, you know, you sort of had a status update with are you chatting,

Adam Pierno 5:57
but there was a there was a wall between, you know, it

Sanya Deshpande 6:00
was yeah, it was a wall, certainly. And I felt like, you know, it’s like, Man, I need to have some analytical skills like this. This needs to, you know, I want to go beyond what I’m doing right now. And, and that’s how I made the leap to PhD. And it was a really, really great experience. For me. It’s been two years, you know, understanding the media landscape servicing major clients like Dr. Zhu Kohler footlocker. So, various different categories. And also, like my time, there are a lot because it was interesting to see how media agencies were really positioning themselves as this culture first audience driven, sort of taking this audience driven approach that could really supercharge the client’s commercial engine. So it was all about like, media that drives to sales. And you know, what does that look like? And how can tools inform that and Omnicom had a tool at the time, which they still do called Omni. And it was all about using that tool to mine audience insights to make smarter media buys. And the whole world was incredibly fascinating, because you saw the journey of, you know, really building and experimenting with media all the way to what it means from a sales standpoint for for major major businesses. So I love that, you know, and for me, it was, perhaps it was a combination of being cooped up in the apartment for months during lockdown. But I started to think a lot about health, and my own health a lot. And I was like, Oh, my God, I need to buy an Apple Watch, I need to get my steps in. I feel so off balance. And it was bizarre because I was in my own life, looking for wearables, and kind of figure out what I wanted to do about my sleep. And it was just this crazy reset during COVID that started to think about my body a lot. And through my network, I heard about world, it was like, Wow, this company’s really cool. And I went down to CrunchBase rabbit hole researching where they’re from,

Adam Pierno 8:01
or whatever the strategists you go to.

Sanya Deshpande 8:05
I was, like, let me get every single piece of information about this company, I want to know what they’re about. They’re so cool. And it was just a it was really fascinating to me what this company can do, it was it was pretty, it’s kind of creepy, I was pretty convinced I wanted to go work there. And so I interviewed and, you know, here I am. So that was sort of the journey to or, but it’s been at or about a year now. And it’s been, you know, a really, really fascinating time with the company and the company has just grown so much since like, you know, in a year. So, you know, I feel like I’m a little bit are sort of like on a rocket ship right now, heading to some great destination, hopefully.

Adam Pierno 8:48
Yeah. And that’s, that’s part of what I wanted to talk to you about is, you know, the coming directly from a PhD, where you were using on me and you were figuring out those customer insights, audience insights through media consumption, and through media habits into or where your direct to consumer, you’re connecting and trying to figure out other ways to get, you know, build that relationship with with that customer and that prospective customer. How, you know, what was the culture shock like, or what was the adaptation like for you as a thinker, you know, looking at that from a different all of a sudden you’re on the other side of the two way mirror?

Sanya Deshpande 9:28
I think, you know, you as a strategist you’re always told, like storytelling, curiosity and peeking, you know, your audience along with you on a journey is is the core score core skill set of what you know, what makes you you know, interesting and valuable in this business right now. I think it’s like, especially from a from a data standpoint, I think what’s interesting is, you know, the type of storytelling an Oura makes my work really different from past roles is because you’re really creating value for members at every stage of the product experience. It’s, you know, data in any form. And certainly personal data can feel so isolating, you know, especially when you’re mining through tons of it, like, what is this? What is sleeping me? What is my activity mean? Where do 10k steps even mean? You know, and you’re always wondering like, what the data, what you could really do with it. And I think that this is why like, I mean, it felt like worming is so powerful, because it’s informing you and guiding you. And it’s a far more immersive experience than just reporting on what’s going on in your body. So I think, for me, you know, it’s been very interesting, because even with the messaging, or the types of communication you’re putting out there, it’s really understanding, like, how can we generate real value for our members, and then, you know, being sort of on demand side, and really having access to different teams like product and engineering and product marketing, like you’re really able to cross pollinate information and learn from different teams. And so, you know, just feels like there’s so much more reach and scalability within what you’re creating in, you know, strategy and marketing at large. So I think marketing is certainly a very, very important piece of our business and has far reaching impacts on you know, various other disciplines at Oura.

Adam Pierno 11:17
Did you so I know you went through that experience of as a, as a consumer, as a customer of trying to figure out how am I going to get the insights I need to better direct my own health? You know, I’ve been a caged animal here for two years like that during the pandemic, like everybody, or most people I should say, and you were seeking out tools to help you with your health. So you were looking for those? Are you able to apply that, that lens as you are creating programs for prospective and current, or customers or members that you have that insight into, like, what they what they might really need? Or what they’re looking for?

Sanya Deshpande 11:57
Yeah, it’s, it’s a good question, because I think all of us have a little bit of that head on in marketing. So we’ve all found the product in different ways, right, like someone was at a sleep issue. And I think that’s what’s so beautiful about the team in the company is that people have sort of organically found this product and realize that there’s the the mission is so powerful that they want to come work here. So I’m very privileged to have a, you know, people around me, were also thinking about their own experience, you know, what they’re what they’re working on, sort of different projects, their domain, I think they have a very strong voice of customer group who does member studies, and that type of learning is, you know, shared within the company and within marketing on a very frequent basis. So we are very much listening to what members are saying, scores like NPS CSAT are very important to the marketing group understanding what are certain gripes people have? How can we build on our successes, you know, and, and really trying to get ahead as much as we can in terms of what members desire thing in terms of, you know, discovering, or what’s so fascinating to me is, you know, a product like this, or certainly, like, my initial impression was, oh, like, you know, Oura could have in the past just been for a biohacker community, right, or somebody trying to combat asleep issue, but now

Adam Pierno 13:20
it could have been, it could have been really fringe.

Sanya Deshpande 13:22
Exactly. And I think what’s what’s incredible, and in which, you know, I think so fascinating to me, and certainly as a strategist is like, there’s this mainstream health movement, you know, part of it sort of I was on as well, and which has really supercharged this company, and this products growth, that they are as benefits around sleep, for example, and how, how good sleep is the foundation to good health, I think that type of education is something that we really bake into a lot of our communications, and I’m trying to take the lens of like education first, you know, tell the community what they can, what they can learn and do because I do think that there’s a lot of guidance that’s missing in the category think, you know, I’m an Apple Watch consumer, I’m an aural consumer. And I use these products daily basis. And, you know, a lot of it feels like, Hey, this is how, you know, certainly with, with certain products, it’s like, hey, like, here’s how you did like, it’s a little bit of a report, but what do you do with it? How do you take that to the next level, has always been a little missing. So I think for us, from what calm standpoint, like what we would rather what I’ve been really trying to instill even in, in how I think about our strategic initiatives, or you know, where we’re trying to go is, how can we really take this knowledge that we have our consumer to the next level through education, like how can we help them get better? And I think that that’s like, you know, for example, brands like peloton has just done such an incredible job at building a community of members. So, I do think that there’s immense potential for this product to become a real source of truth for Are people and then this sort of, you know, providing this to through providing this daily health guidance?

Adam Pierno 15:06
Now that sounds interesting analog because they have the bike is the mechanism but the yeses are something that people rally around and the the instructors become these totems that they can build community and some followings around, what, what are the, what’s the connective tissue for or what are some of the elements that you’re that you explore, and that way that is like, can serve as the medium for people to form bonds around.

Sanya Deshpande 15:33
So we do have within the Oura, there’s something called the Explorer tab, which is where, you know, various types of meditation and mindfulness content lives. And that’s sort of the part of the experience that’s meant to be a lot more immersive, because you’re turning on, you know, like four or five minute meditation and then you’re, that’s a counted into your experience within the app. So the content practice is fast and furiously developing. And we’re, we’re really trying to sort of, you know, figure out, like, what are the different ways we can keep people engaged? Because I do think this is, you know, to me, it’s certainly a product strength, in many ways, but you know, we’re not about flashing screens, I mean, the form factor is so sleek, and so subtle, there’s no, no screen, there’s no bullet, you know, tons of things like talking to you, it’s a very discreet experience. And, and I think that’s why people love it, because the form factor is so subtle, and you can sleep with it, and you can, you know, sweat in it, and it works for every occasion, you know, doesn’t look like this, like clunky thing on your hand. And I think that there’s, from a content standpoint, a lot of opportunity, you know, for us with our with our Explore tab and the app that we’re building, but even beyond, I think, hopefully, in the future, you know, we’ll be able to really expand what content looks like for us without, you know, in the absence of the screen, or you know, real like real estate that we can own this outside of the app.

Adam Pierno 17:02
Yeah, but that’s actually a really positive differentiator when I see Yeah. Do you see people wearing the Apple Watch? And then I’m like, okay, that’s an Apple Watch person. It is noticeable. You see it, it’s, it’s lighting up while they’re talking to you, sometimes it’s distracting not always. And this is more like a secret nod between piano like, you might I probably have already interacted with people today that, that were wearing one and I wouldn’t even notice unless I was Yeah, keenly aware, like trying to figure it out. Is that something that is deliberate or are you looking for are you trying to minimize you know, is that something that’s attractive to customers that it’s not showy? Or it’s not highly visible and nobody asks them questions about Oh, you don’t you’re trying to do this or you’re trying to do that.

Sanya Deshpande 17:51
Yeah, totally. I think I think that tension you know, with a lot of receivables although they’re they’re certainly ahead from a features and a hardware standpoint, they’re doing a ton and you know, at the forefront of innovation is that they do tend to be bulky we often and I think what’s what’s interesting about Oura is they go there’s a little bit of like you know, it’s style married with accuracy, right? Like it’s very accurate and gives you a really strong read on your sleep your activity your readiness, but then there is like this very, like very obvious style aspect of it and it’s this sense of like you know, functional jewelry if you will, like there’s a lot of function you get out of it, but it could also you know, look like a piece of jewelry. I certainly think there’s a lot of ways to draw in people through that angle and it’s something we’ve been playing up in our to our sort of evergreen like ads as well outside of campaigns.

Adam Pierno 18:51
Yeah, sorry, I’m grilling you about Oura which I which I tend to do what I’m sorry for one as we’re as we’re talking so I’m like oh what about this? What about that?

Sanya Deshpande 18:59
I love it I love it. He you know, there’s there’s a beautiful colors and style. So if you need a recipe, what looks good on various types of pens, I’m happy to

Adam Pierno 19:13
glide had an affiliate link to this podcast. No, yeah, never. Tell me more about the shift from you know, traditional consumer marketing to direct to consumer marketing. And we talked a little bit about the change in culture, but how does it change your approach to the work like where you start and the sources of information you go to to build a plan or to build a program versus how it is inside a DTC or

Sanya Deshpande 19:44
what’s really interesting when you when you start to sort of build and master your your craft and strategy is that I feel like I learned this sort of observe this from people who are extremely good to different places, and I was like, wow, this is like, like, what I’d like to be when I grew up is that the is that the strategy skill set is actually, frankly applicable to any type of move you make. I mean, you learn to analyze businesses culture competition, very true to what I’m still, you know, doing today and my approach to work, you learn the tools to unearth what makes people take how to connect with them very core to the member experience or understanding like, what do people love about this part of not? Like, how can we improve it? What are people looking for the variables at large. And, and a lot of the interesting insights around have has been that people want wearables that look as good as they make you feel, because they don’t want this clunky thing, they want to show off beautiful jewelry and watches. And, and in this, you know, this sort of discreet, wearable is becoming appealing to people so that understanding those type of insights, you know, and certainly something that I’d always been doing now just, you know, different lens. And then you know, you learn to distill it complex concepts, and you identify patterns and shapes, simple solution space thinking. So if it’s, you know, starting the project around the strategic initiative for, for the product team, I think my role is often understanding Well, what are some broader business problems we’re dealing with? What are some broader like perception issues? From an awareness standpoint? Where do we stand and you know, certainly, like we were nowhere to where, awareness wise wear an Apple watches, and there’s so much work to be done. So there is I think, for me, I haven’t felt, I mean, I think the application has been very different. Because certainly now you’re involved in growing a business and a brand more in a more hands on week, because we’re all very close to sales and brand metrics. And I’m like, looking at sales trackers every day and looking at you know, we have a very strong customer experience group who share insights on Slack every day. So you’re hearing about what people are, are seeing or the types of customer complaints or inbound you’re getting more are good things people are sharing, too. So I think that there’s a lot more information I have in hand, which is, which is just great and feel more immersed and have like, an understanding of the business, but the skill set per se, like how you begin work, like the four C’s, the sort of all the good, like strategy frameworks, I think have have stuck with me, I don’t think that that’s changed a lot. The application certainly has a lot. I love it. I think it’s just there’s so much there. And you know, it’s funny, like when you’re just a group of strategies, everyone’s talking the same thing. But when you’re actually at a company that’s very product driven. Everyone’s like, Wow, man, I never thought about this in the same way. You know, I’m like, Huh? There we go.

Adam Pierno 22:58
And I’m sitting in a room with a bunch of smart people that, you know, engineers and product, people that have their own excactly

Sanya Deshpande 23:04
are so smart, and they’re so good at what they do. And then they look at you like you’re, you know, like, a type of genius in the room that you came up with this? No, no, this is all culture. You just have to keep your eyes open.

Adam Pierno 23:18
I didn’t invent this. I’m just I’m just winging it. Yeah, exactly. How do you?

How do you know, you know, in that, going in house, and and getting all that data fed to you not data, but insights. So the product team is sending you information, the sales team is saying, Hey, we saw this. How do you sort it and prioritize it and bring it back to them in the most meaningful way and work with teams that people often think the insight they figured out is the most important one, when you have 20 Different people or five different teams contributing insights? How do you work through that with the teams

Sanya Deshpande 23:58
we have, we do have a really strong process within the team where in even at an executive level, very strategic initiatives and company goals and where like, corporate goals are shared, and roadmaps are built for each team, whether it’s marketing science products, so there is, you know, a level of clarity, I guess, in terms of when you begin the year, you know, what some of the big priorities for your chemo are, where the company is trying to go. What so I think that in that sense, you know, aligning a lot with the business priorities, aligning marketing priorities with business priorities, to me has been, you know, a huge learning curve, because previously you didn’t really like especially when I was, you know, on the agency side, like, and this is, of course, just by way of the client agency dynamic. You didn’t really have access into a ton of like business plans or very specific documents from different teams. It was often like, you’d have one person on the client side who you were dealing with and they would sort of sift through have the information and send it to you. And here it’s sort of like this incredible, like blue face of sorts. Right? And so, you know, I think aligning marketing priorities with where the business is going and how, what we need to do from a sales perspective business perspective, I think that that’s been been key for me in terms of like, what are the projects that are really going to move the needle on sales, where the projects are really going to, you know, sort of remove friction from member experience, or frankly, introduce work in a completely different light, you know, how they stumble upon? Or like, how can we improve that experience? How can we become more visible? Like, there are those sorts of strategic initiatives that ladder up with where the business wants to go? And, you know, I think those are certainly prioritized, because there’s, I think, this focus on value creation in startups, and which is really, you know, I think, incredible, especially high growth startups, because it’s all about okay, like, how do you really get to that next level of growth? And I think that that’s certainly been a sector in orange journey around that, and it’s grown a ton. So I think that that’s how you usually prioritize?

Adam Pierno 26:10
And has that impacted the way you work with agencies? Are you? Are you managing agency relationships, or participating in that work? And then figuring out how do you, you know, how does your experience coming from the agency side help how you curate what’s provided to them?

Sanya Deshpande 26:27
Yeah, it’s funny, because every time I have an agency call, it’s sort of deja vu experience. And certainly, when there’s a strategist on the other side, I’m like, Oh, my God, I was just there a minute ago, I totally understand how you feel. And so I think I have immense empathy for, for agency folks that

Adam Pierno 26:48
are trying to like figure out what’s the most important thing is speed.

Sanya Deshpande 26:52
Exactly. And it’s hard. And it’s like, it’s also the, you know, I get it, like, you don’t have access to a ton of the fields information, or like, you know, the information that’s very core to the business, and you’re still trying to figure out how to, like, from what you have drive commercial value for a business. So it’s, you know, as a participant in that relationship, I, it’s interesting to me, because I think we will we’ve been able to do is also, I think, understand what, you know, different agencies do best I mean, you know, we have a, there’s a lot of potential in terms of building an organic community and Oura that comes from types of content that builds more brand, love and earns trust. And you know, you have more of that education point of view. Whereas when it comes to paid media, people are like, you know, dooms curling, as we know, right, and to get someone’s attention and to be like, Hey, this is not jewelry, hey, this is not just this. I like to also explain that it does all these amazing things for your body, like, and then, you know, for people that may have known Oren and me have sort of thought about it as just asleep cracker. It’s also breaking that perception a little bit of like, note or knowledge asleep, it does everything. So it’s like, I think different agencies have different directives, if you will heard like types of content, or, you know, the work that they need to create to really move the needle, I think gone on both brand and sales metrics. So I think we’ve been trying to really, you know, build that infrastructure where agencies can do what they do best. Because I do think, you know, sometimes, I mean, I certainly felt this, you You always had the client expecting you to do everything correctly, right? Like the drive theme fame, drive business, and do this and do that. And you always felt like, Oh my God, how many things am I juggling right now? So? So yeah, we’ve been learning getting better and evolving.

Adam Pierno 28:52
And how do you inside the organization? How do you balance sales with brand, you know, because you do have to be pretty direct so that people understand like, No, it’s not just a ring, as you pointed out, it’s it does all these things for you, which is a lot to explain even though it it’s simple, but when you want someone to really understand it, it can be a lot how do you balance that in the work that you’re doing? How much of it is brand building and how much of it is driving sales?

Sanya Deshpande 29:25
Yeah, I think that that’s a it’s a really interesting question certainly for you know, high growth startups right because it’s, you know, without sales you you can’t unlock right the reality there so and it is such a wrong product that you know, it’s been a lot of the sales in the past I’ve actually been worried about related so people just finding out or hearing or your point like we always at Oura played this game of like looking at people’s hands. I always do this at restaurants and when I see a rail Yes. It’s like, it’s so funny, because now it’s like, that’s where my eyes go course to people’s hands. And, you know, so I think it’s really interesting because you have to be very, I don’t know, I don’t personally, I don’t see them as like this or that, I think they have to work together. And I think that’s sort of what we are very much striving to do at Oura as well, like, it’s definitely give commercial value is critical to every single aspect of a business and to be able to grow and unlock more, you know, sort of budget for innovation, for experimentation, etc, etc. But at the same time, like brand building is extremely important that we are talking about people’s health, like we want to, I think, you know, when you when you feel a certain way about a brand, and you feel like it enhances your routine, and you know, helps you like excites you, brings you joy, and you know, it helps you build a strong emotional connection with it. Like, where that brand can go is really like incredible. So I think we certainly have the makings of that, because you’re, it’s on you’re like, we have, like, we command 24 hours of your day, because you’re on the finger the whole time. So it’s not like, it’s like a thing you put away and you forget about it, just like on your fingers.

Adam Pierno 31:21
Like Fitbit, like people will wear it for the first week or month, and then they take it off one day, and then all of a sudden, they haven’t worn it for a week. Yeah. Yes. Is on do you do find though that because it’s discreet? It is harder to? Yeah, I’m wearing it. But have you observed people that, you know, kind of forget, like, they lose touch with the brand, even though it’s on them? Because it’s so discreet?

Sanya Deshpande 31:45
Yeah. And I think that that’s where, like the storytelling you like, we really like, you know, that’s like a huge pillar for us, right, like, through through social education through you know, we talked about like this Daylight Savings Time example, but like that people like don’t know what time change can do for their, for their bodies, and being able to be present in a cultural moment and talk about me, like, like, doing science terrible for you, makes you bloat, you know, you don’t feel great, people actually wake up more groggy, and here’s their, you know, here are some ways that you can, you know, you can combat it, or for Valentine’s Day, he didn’t really cheeky one about the benefits of sex on sleep. And turns out, you know, sex is great for sleep. So talking about something that’s, you know, again, from this like lens of education, and it brings people in a little bit more into your like world, because I think that that’s, that’s where, you know, the brand love is formed when you feel like you have a connection, or like, or is giving you guidance, or this is sort of like this, this companion in your life, it’s like it’s on your finger, but it’s also a brand that, you know, it’s an authority on sleep, and on health, and you can turn to them to get better, right. And I think that there are these really mysterious connections people have been able to make with, with their sleep data, for example, like when you when you really discover like, if you had a lake meal, or you drink caffeine or alcohol, like your stomach clock instantly impacts your sleep clock, and the rain gives you those signals. So that type of information, like when you discover that you’re like, oh, man, I had no idea. Or, you know, we recently announced a period prediction beta now to temperature, we’re able to, you know, sort of help women prepare for their menstrual cycle and being able to provide the type of information as well as has really anything brought people in to the product and and made them more engaged, which, you know, hopefully the brand can only, like, accelerate and expand that experience even further, but I do see them you know, is hand in hand and that’s what we are. We’ve been you’ve been building at Oura.

Adam Pierno 33:59
Yeah, and it sounds like it’s building the brand inside out. So it’s with with users, or members and getting them to be to earn earn their trust, get them excited about it, get them potentially to tell other people about it or not, but just be excited and continue to use the product. Yeah. And then do I guess my question is, do you think that’s consistent with other direct to consumer brands that it’s it’s more about getting that specific user group like so understanding what it is and building the brand with that group that that when more people bring it up to them? Oh, you use this tell me about it. They’re like yes, let me tell you about it. Yeah,

Sanya Deshpande 34:40
I think so. I mean, I think that that I think community tends to be usually like this like secret sauce for a lot of brands that are you know, just do so well and has like supercharged growth I mean, you know, again, like not to keep talking about peloton, but like peloton is a great example of like community of a million followers who all feel the same way. We’d have a shared connection. And I think that, you know, similarly for or I think that that’s certainly, you know, being able to build that and and build on that, from from brands that are doing that really well. Is is well is an aspiration and something that the, you know, will sort of keep working on. Very cool.

Adam Pierno 35:22
Well, Sonya, thank you so much for making time for me today.

Sanya Deshpande 35:25
Thank you. This is great. I’m so glad we were able to connect and you know, have you to nerd out on all things strategy or and hopefully you I’ve convinced you to get a ring after

Adam Pierno 35:36
this. After I have the website up, I’m on the chopping page here.

So we’ll see what happens. Good, good.

All right. Well, great talking to you.

The Strategy Inside Everything is produced by me, Adam Pierno. If you like what you’ve heard, leave a review wherever you listen to podcasts. Actually, I have no idea if that helps, or if it’s ever done anybody any good. If you really want to help the show, and you like what you heard, share it with someone else who you think will dig it. That’s the best way to help the show and keep the conversation growing. If you have an idea, a question or want to push back, go to where you can send me a message or leave me a voicemail, they’ll be added to future shows. Music for The Strategy Inside Everything is by Sawsquarenoise. For more information on me, you can go to to learn about my books, my speaking and my consulting practice. Thanks for listening

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